How a Children’s Book Publisher Remains Nimble and Successful

Maria Dismondy, Founder and Publisher of Cardinal Rule Press, a children's book publisher whose catalog focuses on realistic fiction titles that embody the principles of diversity, equity, and inclusion, discusses what inspired her to start the company along with the strategies she and her team have used to help the business grow and remain successful.

Transcript

Nicole Tomassi: 0:07

Welcome to Westchester words, education, ed tech and publishing I'm Nicole Tomassi, and in this episode, I'll be talking with Maria Dismondy, who is an author and the founder and publisher of Cardinal Rule Press. Maria, it's a pleasure to welcome you to Westchester words.

Maria Dismondy: 0:22

Thank you. I'm I'm looking forward to this conversation

Nicole Tomassi: 0:25

As am I, so to get things started for listeners who may not be familiar with you or Cardinal rule press., can you tell us a little bit about yourself and your company?

Maria Dismondy: 0:35

Absolutely. I actually started out in education. So I was a first and second grade teacher for just over a decade, and from there I realized I wanted a book to read to my students that I couldn't find. And so I wrote it, and that book is called Spaghetti, a hot dog bun, and it came out in 2008. So ever since then, I've continued to build my writing career, but I hung up my writing hat a few years ago, and I decided, I think the teacher in me, because I did resign from teaching when I started doing all this, the teacher in me really wanted to be teaching. And so I started publishing other people's picture books and I am working with our authors, and teaching them how to build a brand and to market their books.

Nicole Tomassi: 1:22

That's a very different way for going about a publishing company. So you're a mentor as well as a publisher. It sounds like.

Maria Dismondy: 1:28

Absolutely.

Nicole Tomassi: 1:30

What inspired you to make the shift from being a classroom teacher to publishing yourself as well as mentoring and publishing other authors?

Maria Dismondy: 1:39

I was full-time teaching and then the book had come out and I was scheduling author visits on my vacations with local school districts. And I started to see that my income was quite a bit different. I could truly work part-time as an author and a speaker versus working full-time as a teacher. And at the time I was pregnant with our first child, and so it just really made sense for our family, for me to continue to build out that writing business.

Nicole Tomassi: 2:08

So, in what ways do you find that the experiences you gained as a classroom teacher help inform the work that you do as both an author and a publisher?

Maria Dismondy: 2:17

One of the r easons I wrote Spaghetti in a hot d og b un i s b ecause when I was looking f or books that spoke to self-esteem and having c ourage to be yourself, I was finding books with characters that were dinosaurs and fluffy bunnies. And I noticed that there was not a lot of realistic fiction in 2008 picture books. And it really bothered me because I taught in a diverse community and my students weren't seeing themselves within the pages of the books. So I think that's one area of my teaching that really filters through Cardinal r ule p ress because our books are all strategically realistic fiction, and we really do focus on diversity and being able to incorporate different perspectives i n our stories.

Nicole Tomassi: 3:03

That's such an important thing, especially now with everything that's transpired over the last several years, uh, it's been shown how important it is for children to be able to see themselves in the education materials that they're coming across, as well as the, uh, books that they're reading, just for fun.

Maria Dismondy: 3:19

Absolutely.

Nicole Tomassi: 3:20

I, I would imagine that, you know, being a parent as well as a teacher, some of those experiences also probably guides the decisions that you make about which books that you're choosing to publish. Is that accurate?

Maria Dismondy: 3:33

Yeah. There's a couple things that we really think about. One, we don't wa nt t o select a manuscript that's already saturated in the market, something that's completely overdone. Yo u t r y t o research what is missing in the curriculum in schools right now, how can we help fill their need? A big part of our following on social media is teachers and I host, u m, t own hall meetings where I've invited teachers to tell us what you ne ed, like, what are things you wanna be seeing in picture books? And I've done the same with librarians too.

Nicole Tomassi: 4:07

And I guess you get a lot of on the ground feedback from those town hall meetings.

Maria Dismondy: 4:12

We do. Yeah, we do. You know, we're really looking at, okay, what do people need? But at the same time, we have to look at the other end, like what can we provide? And we can't always provide what people need, like nonfiction. We're a small press. I think this really has come from my teaching background. I know that slow and steady wins the race. I truly do. Our students are different types of learners. And I know if you take your time with something it's going to be, it's going to be done well. Um, and it's going to come to completion. And so we really, we could publish more books every year, but I've had to hold myself back and say, Nope, we're going to keep our numbers low and we're gonna really do them well, and we're gonna market these books well, and we're going to work with our authors and we're gonna really put a lot of support behind everything.

Nicole Tomassi: 5:00

So quality over is what I'm hearing. From a business perspective, obviously the last couple of years have been quite challenging when it comes to the production side of it, printing the books, uh, the distribution channels and those sorts of things and children's books, especially they're oftentimes printed overseas. And I'm just wondering how has that all impacted you in terms of Cardinal rule press and being able to publish the books that you are putting out into the market?

Maria Dismondy: 5:32

Yeah, you know, at the beginning of 2020, it really wasn't affecting us because we have someone on our team who's an analyst and she does forecasting for inventory. So she's looking year, over year. What's our inventory. What are our busy months? What are our slow months and what do we have on hand? And so she's constantly keeping in touch with me every month. What do I need to order? So we had a really good amount of stock of our books. We had a good handle on everything and then dun dun dun. Um, about three weeks ago, I got my last invoice for 2021 from our printer. And they had to double our shipping costs because of everything that's going on right now with the supply and demand, um, issues.

Nicole Tomassi: 6:17

And, um, just to clarify, are you printing your books domestically or are you bringing them in from overseas?

Maria Dismondy: 6:24

We do both. So we, for our larger orders, we bring them in from overseas.

Nicole Tomassi: 6:28

And did you find that all the, uh, supply chain challenges that we were hearing so much about, uh, both within the trade and general media, did you find that that was impacting your on sale dates and those sort of things?

Maria Dismondy: 6:40

No, it, it really didn't impact our on sale dates. It just truly impacted our budget with the double and the increase in the shipping.

Nicole Tomassi: 6:49

Wow, you're one of the lucky ones then, cuz I have heard some really interesting stories., Um, I have

Maria Dismondy: 6:55

I have too, Yeah, I have too. And to be honest, I think part of it is the forecasting and we have really long lead times with our distributors. So, you know, we have the books printed six months before the book is on the market and we have them in our warehouse six months beforehand. So, um, if anything we, because of those lead times we've been okay, but we got hit with the shipping so.

Nicole Tomassi: 7:18

That long range forecasting and, and being able to have the warehouse to, to stock the titles until the on sale date probably has helped give you a bit of a cushion. Are you finding that's still tending to hold as you're looking at your 22 year?

Maria Dismondy: 7:33

Well, another issue we're coming about right now domestically is paper sourcing. So, um, typically when we print here domestically, it's about six weeks to eight weeks. Um, from the time we place the order to the time we get the books, but now, um, being able to find paper and to have inventory and stock at the, at the warehouse for the printer is an issue. And so their lead times are 12 to 13 weeks.

Nicole Tomassi: 8:01

Since you have a pretty long lead time on getting your books into the warehouse, you could probably absorb that. I'm guessing, yeah. Kinda scratching at this a little bit further, but you know, from, from the other side, once the books are out in the marketplace, how are things going in terms of, you know, being able to conduct author events? I mean, in person is such a, an important, uh, strategy, especially with children's books. So, um, how did you adjust to everything going on, you know, with your sales and marketing team and how did you pivot to be able to promote the books in a safe way?

Maria Dismondy: 8:35

You know, we had a book launch, on um, May 1st, 2020. And so we had to pivot pretty quickly. We were also in the middle of a book launch, um, that a book came out March 1st, 2020, and that book had already gone through a media Blitz. So we were safe there. Um, we did have to cancel in-person events, but what we did as far as pivoting is we hopped over to zoom. And for that May 1st release instead of doing a bookstore, um, book release and launch, we did it on zoom and it was our most popular book release ever. Um, we had over a hundred people in attendance and we have continued to do that since even though some bookstores, you know, have opened up to the idea of in-person events, we found that it's great to offer that virtual aspect because you know, the author lives in California, but she has family all over the world. Her daughter lives in Nicaragua and they were able to attend the book event. So that was one major way we had pivoted with the launches. That book was called Evie''s field day and it, because schools were closed, we thought, okay, well what's gonna happen with field day. So we hosted an at home field day and we had several families across the nation participating on social media. We, you know, supported them with ideas of things that they could do at home. And we asked and encouraged them to post pictures on social media with a special hashtag. We had prizes for them. So we really just tried to support families, um, taking it into their homes and, and still creating a buzz around the book. Another way that we pivoted was virtual networking. So I attended a lot of conferences before all of this happened to meet people and to talk about things that are happening in the industry, that whole, whole area of networking. And so what we had to do is, you know, switch to virtual. So I have been attending a lot online and trying to keep, um, connected in that way.

Nicole Tomassi: 10:35

We've definitely, noticed the same things, um, in our area of the industry. Connection is so key and however we can do it until we can safely choose. So in person, I wanna touch back a bit on the mentoring aspect of what you do at Cardinal rule press. And when I was preparing for our discussion, I did see that you do offer a mentoring workshop to help your authors market themselves and their books. Was this something that predated the pandemic or is this something that evolved out of that?

Maria Dismondy: 11:04

No, it's something that we actually began before the pandemic. I think my background as a teacher, um, has really made me want to be able to give all I can give to our authors, right. Uh, what works, what doesn't work. And so when I started the company, I, it was included that there was an optional mentorship, a six week program that they would go through, learn all the basics, go deep, dive, deeper into areas that they were uncomfortable with to help them to build and strengthen their brand.

Nicole Tomassi: 11:34

If you had to ballpark it, how many people have gone through this mentor program with Cardinal Rule press

Maria Dismondy: 11:41

About a, about a dozen at this point?

Nicole Tomassi: 11:42

What is their feedback on the experience?

Maria Dismondy: 11:46

Well, it's it, it's interesting. I probably should do a survey. I'm gonna write this down. That is a good suggestion. Um, you know, one of our authors spoke, uh, recently, and I heard her speaking at an event online and just the way she was talking about our company brought tears to my eyes because she not only talked about her own experience, but she talked about how other authors in the industry wished that they could be with us, um, you know, publish with Cardinal rule press because of how we treat their authors and how we educate them and support them.

Nicole Tomassi: 12:19

That's very positive feedback.

Maria Dismondy: 12:21

It is. I haven't heard it firsthand, but, um, I heard it from our author who was sharing what people have told her and it's optional. It's not something that we charge for. I've I actually had an author say, well, do I, I have to pay for that. I'm like, of course you don't have to pay for it. I, I believe that between the authors, us as the publisher Cardinal rule press and the distributor, I believe between the three different organizations or groups that if everyone works together, we're going to be stronger. And it's for the benefit of the same goal, which is to sell books and to make a difference in the world with our messaging.

Nicole Tomassi: 13:00

I think that's a great approach and a wonderful message. Can you talk about a few of the other ways that Cardinal rule press has adapted? I mean, there's so many changes going on in the publishing world and just in the world in general, how have you adapted to all of this?

Maria Dismondy: 13:15

Another thing that we've done Nicole is we have taken books of ours that have not been eBooks in the past, and we have, um, converted them into eBooks so that they're readily available to more classrooms and families. We also have partnered up with American sign language, trans translators interpreters, and we have done online readings with our authors, um, that are being translated and we share those. Those are all available for free on YouTube. So we're trying to be inclusive of different groups and make our books available in that way. I think just having the time as a business owner to take away all of that travel time that I used to have the driving and the, the traveling and having to go places to get something done, it's brought more time into my life. And, um, more time to be able to, like I said, network and, and attend educational seminars for myself to grow as a leader and to learn what are other people doing in the book industry to reach their readers in different ways.

Nicole Tomassi: 14:19

Let's take this out, say like a year or a few years out, where do you see Cardinal rule press in that time?

Maria Dismondy: 14:24

Oh my goodness. Um, how many years did you say?

Nicole Tomassi: 14:28

Let's, let's start with a year.

Maria Dismondy: 14:29

Well, in a year, I hope that we're in a similar place. Um, you know, going strong with our online events, but also I hope in a year that we are in person again and doing some in person events and school visits and things like that. I'd really like to get back to that. Um, we have a strong team. I hope that we continue to, um, you know, have that team. We recently started an internship program. And so in a year I'd like to see that really going strong and, um, take feedback from the interns that go through the program and just make it stronger and even better. And we've done an audit on our books. There are certain topics of diversity that we really wanna make sure that we've covered and represented across our catalog. And I hope in a year that we can cover those that are no longer covered right now in our catalog.

Nicole Tomassi: 15:22

Understood real quick, uh, sidebar the internship. What is it that you want the interns to learn during their time with Cardinal Rule Press?

Maria Dismondy: 15:32

Well, again, I think I really do miss teaching because I, I run the, I run the intern program and it is something that lights me up and I get so excited when we have calls and we have trainings. Um, so for example, when an intern comes onto our program, they going to be in a specific department. So we have a graphic design intern. And one of the things that they get out of the internship is not only are what they going to learn and, um, have hands on experiences in the graphic design department, but we also take them through the different departments. So they have this holistic picture of the publishing industry and the publishing business when they walk away. So they can really see, is this a fit for me? Is it not a fit for me? So that's a big part of what they get.

Nicole Tomassi: 16:22

Before we wrap up our conversation. Maria, is there a piece of advice that you wish someone had given you when you were starting out on this path and what would you share with fellow authors and publishers?

Maria Dismondy: 16:35

Yes, this is, I wish someone would've given me this advice and it is applicable for both authors and publishers to spend time on your processes, as you are starting out. We did it very backwards. I just started the business and was working, working, working. And then about a year ago, we really said, okay, we can work smarter, not harder. We we've gotta figure this out. So we use a program called Asana and it's free, but it's a workflow program. And so for example, Nicole, when you schedule someone on the podcast, I'm sure there's a certain number of steps that you go through that look the same for every single podcast episode. So basically we've created these templates where instead of recreating the wheel, every time we do something, we have a template to use as a guide. And that's really helped free up a lot of space in my brain because I'm not having to put so much work into the day to day workflow and the day to day process. But I can, you know, look outside of that process, cuz it's already there for me and I can get more creative and, you know, be the visionary that I really wanna be.

Nicole Tomassi: 17:41

That's really great advice to try to, you know, have like the procedures in place. And then your mind is freed up to focus on the more creative aspects. Maria, it's been such a pleasure to talk with you today and I wanna thank you so much for taking the time to talk about your experiences in children's book publishing. I wanna wish you continued success with Cardinal rule press.

Maria Dismondy: 18:02

Oh, thank you. This is so much fun, Nicole. And thank you for all that you do for your listeners. We enjoy having podcasts to listen to. And this is again, one of the ways that I've learned so much about the publishing business is through something like this, listening to podcasts. So thank you.

Nicole Tomassi: 18:18

Wow. Well thank you. I really appreciate that. Thank you for listening to this episode of Westchester words. If you're looking for previous episodes or want to read additional content that has been shared by some of our guests, please visit our websites. Westchester publishing services.com and Westchester education services.com. For an international perspective, check out our sister podcast, Westchester words, UK and international available on the Westchester Education, UK website, Westchester education.co.uk or wherever you stream podcasts. We love hearing from our listeners and welcome your emails at Westchester words at Westchester ed SV, cs.com. Tell us what you enjoy hearing on our podcast or suggest topics that we can cover in future episodes. Speaking of future episodes, I look forward to having you join us for the next episode of Westchester words, when we'll be having another engaging conversation about a topic of interest to the education, ed tech and publishing communities. Until then stay safe, be well and stay tuned.